Interview Replay: Kara On Small Business Pivots

Kara Goldin 0:00
I am unwilling to give up that I will start over from scratch as many times as it takes to get where I want to be I want to be you just want to make sure you will get knocked down but just make sure you don’t get knocked down knocked out. So your only choice should be go focus on what you can control control control. Hi everyone and welcome to the Kara Goldin show. Join me each week for inspiring conversations with some of the world’s greatest leaders. We’ll talk with founders, entrepreneurs, CEOs, and really some of the most interesting people of our time. Can’t wait to get started. Let’s go Let’s go. Today’s episode is a bonus episode. Enjoy.

Michael Morrison 0:47
Welcome to small business pivots. I’m your host Michael Morrison as small business coach, and together we are going to explore the stories the strategies and pivots that small business owners have made to build successful businesses doing a million dollars and more. Our guest today Kara Goldin is world renowned. Kara is the founder and former CEO of hint Inc. Best known for its award winning hint water, the leading unsweetened flavored water. She has received numerous accolades including being named EY Entrepreneur of the Year 2017, Northern California, and one of N styles. 2019 badass 50 Previously, Kara was VP of shopping partnerships at America Online. She hosts the podcast the Kara Goldin show, and her first book undaunted, overcoming doubts and doubters was released October 2020. And is now a W SJ M, Amazon Best Seller. Let’s get to Karen now and learn the pivot she made in life and business to build a successful empire from the ground up. Alright, welcome Carrie to small business pivots. I appreciate you taking time. What part of this wonderful world do you come to us from?

Kara Goldin 2:02
I am in Marin County. So just outside of San Francisco about 20 minutes north of the city. Oh, very

Michael Morrison 2:09
cool. So if I or listener were to visit, there’s there’s something special to do around that that you like to do. You

Kara Goldin 2:16
know, there’s a lot in Marin County, I mean, we’re right smack in between the wine country, and then and San Francisco. But there’s there’s a lot of hiking trails. There’s also the bay. So on one side of the one on one is Forest. And my house backs up to 100 acres of trails. Wow. And, and the other side of the one on one is the San Francisco Bay. So if you want to go if you want to go sailing, or my latest toy is something called the Red shark bike, which which is amazing. And it’s a bike on a paddleboard, and yeah, it’s so fun. That’s something I can do on the ocean. Yeah, as a matter of fact, but the bay is pretty mellow. I mean, you know, once you it’s interesting, there’s, there’s the bay, and then there’s the Golden Gate Bridge, and just beyond the Golden Gate Bridge, you have to be a pretty good sailor to be on that other side of the Golden Gate Bridge. Because there’s, the currents are pretty. So the the joke I guess it’s not very funny if you ever got stuck over there, but the joke is that you would be headed for China. It takes you it takes you and so I’ve actually been on some sailboats with some pretty good sailors and you can see I mean it literally is on a windy day. I mean it’s it’s pretty you have to be a pretty good sailor so I don’t say all I joined people who are good sailors, but I have a couple sons that sail but you know, even though they’re great sailors, they’re still not as as as equipped to actually do the kind of sailing that goes beyond the Golden Gate Bridge. So so that’s the story of Moran.

Michael Morrison 4:14
Yes. Well, that’s nice to know, because I love to hike, and we don’t hear that there’s hiking trails like that. So I appreciate you sharing. So if I ever come that way, I know I can hike because I love hiking. Definitely, well, you are one of the most impactful inspiring people that I know on this plan. And I love connecting with you on LinkedIn every day you share some posts that help people. And I know as entrepreneurs and founder CEOs, we don’t always hear those impactful stories. And so I just want to share one with you real quick because that kind of leads in that’s the segue into my first question. So I Leland and Tish Tate who own Fiddler marketing they it’s a food sales service agency. They represent food and beverage. They came to me one day because I had just gone through a nasty business Glad partnerships split. And so it caused the business to file bankruptcy caused me to file bankruptcy. And Leland came to me and said, Hey, we have a second floor we’re not using in our building. Why don’t you use that to get back on your feet free of charge? I still get goosebumps thinking about that. Because I was like, wow, there’s people that care. There’s people that’s impacting others. Yeah. And so I was in his office one day. And he said, you want a bottle of water? And I said, Sure. And so he handed me a, you know, a hint water bottle. And I said, what is that? And he said, Just try it. You’ll love it. We drink it all the time. And so I tried it. And I was like, Well, where do you get this from? And he said, Well, you have to order it on Amazon. I was like, But wait, you’re in the food beverage record, you know, you represent all these lines. And we can’t get that. And he said, What just ordered online. To this day, they in Oklahoma, they are your biggest fans. And they are raving fans. And not only that, but this day, currently, they represent hint in Oklahoma and Texas. So you’re are impacting people you don’t even know about, they led me to hint, I drink it now. And you also I know they’re very gracious for your business. But not only that, but you bring a healthy product to the market. Because I’m like you I’ve read the book. So I know that water tastes boring from time to time. So we need a little flavor in it. So you’re not only impacting others, fine in a financial way. But you’re also impacting others in a healthy way. So, but this also possibly didn’t happen because you call yourself an accidental entrepreneur. So what do you think that means? And what what impact do you are you using in that platform?

Kara Goldin 6:37
Well, you know, it’s interesting, I never thought that I was going to become an entrepreneur. And not that there’s anything wrong with being an entrepreneur, but we we didn’t have in college at a major and entrepreneurship or people weren’t talking about becoming an entrepreneur. So when I graduated from school, I wanted to be a journalist, I wanted to write I wanted to change the world. So I guess that’s kind of like being an entrepreneur, how entrepreneurs describe themselves. But it was, it wasn’t until I had had experiences that really helped me to understand that if I didn’t actually take the idea that I had, and put spikes in the ground as I as I like to say, and, and actually go out and try to solve the problem, that I was actually becoming an entrepreneur, I’ll never forget, when I got the first bottles on the shelf at Whole Foods in San Francisco. I have a friend I was sharing with a friend, I didn’t tell very many people because I was known as a tech executive. And here I was like, creating a product, a water product in my kitchen and getting it on the shelf at Whole Foods. And so I was sharing with a close friend of mine. And she said, that’s so cool that you decided to become an entrepreneur, and I stopped in my tracks and I thought I decided to become an entrepreneur. No, no, I’m just getting a bottle on the shelf at Whole Foods. And she said no, you’re you’re starting your company, you created a product that is going to help a lot of people that’s an entrepreneur, and I and I was like, oh, no, that’s really scary entrepreneurs. Like that’s a really hard thing. That’s that’s takes a lot of money. You know, it’s it’s, you know, people like Steve Jobs are entrepreneurs, I’m not an entrepreneur. Right. And, and so, but But what I realized more than anything is that entrepreneurs come in all shapes and sizes, some people who become entrepreneurs, and successful entrepreneurs will tell you that they always knew that they were going to be an entrepreneur. And that wasn’t me at all. But I think more than anything, I figured out that I had an idea, and it was mind to go out and try. And I also think it was really helpful to be able to have worked for people that were entrepreneurs, primarily in, in media and, and in tech. I worked early on for Ted Turner, not directly for Ted Turner, but in his organization when it was in only about 40% of households. So think of all those like little channels right now on on your TV that you know, you’re just now hearing about it. Maybe the content isn’t exactly what you want to subscribe to right now. But that was CNN. And when I was there and then ultimately I ended up moving out to Silicon Valley, and ended up working for a startup that was a spin out of Apple. That was a Steve Jobs idea. And Steve didn’t come with it. But a whole group of people that had worked on the project inside of Apple decided to start this company. And it was five guys who had amazing experience at Apple, but had also Steve had left Apple and they had decided to leave Apple as well and start this company. And so the combination, I think of being in sort of a mid sized with CNN startup, and then a really early stage startup, yeah, that, that gave me the courage to know that most of the time, neither of them knew what they were doing. They had an idea that, that was, that was both of them had great ideas, but they also had a vision that wasn’t incubated yet. Yeah, and wasn’t mature yet. And what they really needed needed was beyond the idea they needed to execute, they needed to, to put stakes in the ground for their team to say, Okay, here’s where we’re going, here’s the successes. Okay, we had a little bit of a failure here. But that’s okay, let’s get back up again. And we can go left this time, right, we were going right before, and we can, we can go left. So I think it helped a lot. To know that, I guess, to coin, the the name of my book on Donta, it became less daunting for me having seen and worked for entrepreneurs, who were trying to build something and ultimately did. And then finally, our, that little startup I was talking about was acquired by another startup, which I was at prior to starting my own company, which was called America Online. And, and so Steve Case, was, was at the helm. And it was an online service. So you probably wouldn’t want me to say this, but it was not the leading online service. When they acquired us, there was CompuServe, and prodigy and a few others out there. Wow. And, and so, you know, I also saw what it meant to be an underdog, right and doing things that were a little bit different. And trying to create a more simple, graphically interesting service that Steve really believed was what consumers wanted. And I ultimately was running the E commerce and online partnerships for America Online. That’s what I was doing inside of this tiny little startup prior to him acquiring us. And ultimately, that became, AOL became a big company, the number one online service and a, and it was, you know, an incredible run, it was the early days of direct to consumer, when no one thought that it was going to happen. People who were my clients, like, you know, Jeff Bezos set, it was my bookstore. And yeah, I mean, it was just, you know, crazy time of, of being in a place where there’s a bunch of builders and a bunch of creators. That’s,

Michael Morrison 13:45
that’s interesting, because most of our listeners are either small business owners that are stuck and not getting anywhere, or they’re people considering starting a business, but they’re fearful of failing. And you mentioned two of the big things right there. One is having the belief. And in other words, these companies started small, you got to start somewhere. And all companies do was having having the belief and then also failing, would you consider those kind of two key traits that are experiences that people should go through to understand it’s okay to fail? It’s okay to start small. But you got to believe what you’re doing. From your experience, from your point of view. How did you see that in those names that you were talking about? Well,

Kara Goldin 14:28
I think that a lot of people talk about failure I talk about I’ve had plenty of failures. I don’t think anybody does or, or should plan on failing, right? I mean, it’s just not it’s not in your business plan, that you’re going to go out and spend money and time and all of these things and go out and fail. But the reality is, is that you will, there will be failures along the way. And hopefully you’re going to learn from those things. But it? Absolutely, I mean, I think that, that the key thing is, is, you know, curiosity. And I, I now believe, I don’t know if I would have been able to articulate it back then. But I think people are given a gift, right. And they, they’re given an idea. And they’re given a, maybe some introductory tools to go out and try and solve something. And if they don’t do it, that’s a choice. Right? It’s, it’s sort of, I think about it as sliding doors, right? You, you know, you can either take that door or not take that door. Right. But if you take that door, what, what I think is that you’re not going to regret it. Right? The number one thing I had Daniel Pink on my podcast a few weeks ago. He’s a pretty well known author. Yeah. And, and he has a new, excellent book out called regrets. And, and I think that’s the actual name of it, but it’s about regrets. And, and, you know, it’s fascinating, because the number one, he did a survey of 30,000 people worldwide. And he figured that the regrets of people in America would be different than the regrets of people in India, or female regrets would be different than male regrets or education. He based it on a lot of different things. And while there were some differences and how people articulated different things, that the number one regret was not actually doing something or sitting in one place. Yeah, so he, so he talked about travel, that like the people who never went outside of their hometown, they never went and found a new job. All of these things. It’s sort of leads back to we have to go outside of our comfort circle, we have to go out and try things, because the last thing you want to live with is Regret. Regret.

Michael Morrison 17:17
Yeah, I didn’t survey 30,000 people, but I have surveyed a lot of elderly people as I get older, just kind of asking what they would have done differently. And there’s two words that I hear more often than not that they say, and it’s I wish and that wish could have been. But they’re at that point in their life where they’re not mobile anymore. Or maybe they don’t have the the mind to work in the capacity, like when they were younger. So it’s a huge regret, like they wish they would have done this or that. And so that’s a great point. And so you think it’s called regret. There’s the I’m

Kara Goldin 17:52
pretty sure. Got it around here somewhere. But it’s, it’s Yeah, I think it’s called regret, Daniel Pink. And it’s, let me just see, really,

Michael Morrison 18:04
I love that that idea. It’s, it’s

Kara Goldin 18:07
really, it’s a quick read. And I mean, he’s, he’s just brilliant. And he’s written seven books, and it’s just, he’s definitely a He’s incredible. The power of regret, the power of looking backward, moves us forward.

Michael Morrison 18:26
Okay. Very cool. Thanks for sharing. So is it already out? Or do you know, you said, yeah,

Kara Goldin 18:30
no, it’s it’s already out. So it’s, it’s really a great yeah, it’s, it’s interesting. After I interviewed him, I thought a lot about my father had actually come from the food industry, he developed a product called Healthy Choice. And was that originally armour food company where he developed it, and then they were acquired by ConAgra. Long, crazy story of a journey that he had, but ultimately, when he was 65, he retired and, and that was, you know, kind of the way things were, had to require. Yeah, like, it was just you. That’s what you had to do. And he was counting down the days until he retired. He loved to play golf. So he’s like, I’m gonna go and play golf every single day. It’s gonna be amazing. And after about a week, he couldn’t find anybody play golf with them because he and he got he was so lonely. And he was like, this was really stupid. Like, why did I think that not actually having a plan, not actually knowing what I was going to do next and what I was going to be spending my time on, and so is when he passed away. I mean, the one thing that he regretted he’s like, never retire. Always be doing something, do something. Do nonprofit work, do always have something that keeps you busy and keeps your mind thinking about things and too, and you know, playing golf every single day, even though he loved it was just not going to do it for him. Plus, it was really expensive and for all of those things, but, but it was, but you know, it’s interesting because people think that, you know, I’m just going to stay home, I’m just going to, you know, do this. And it’s really not that great. You have to go outside of your comfort zone and have to whether that’s traveling or starting a company, or whatever that is, yeah,

Michael Morrison 20:29
that’s great advice. I hear from small business owners who I mostly work with as a business coach, and they want to hit that million dollar mark. And for those of us or for those that hit that million that we’ve helped, their first response is I thought I would feel differently. And I’m like, Well, that’s because you just set the bench here, and you don’t have anything to look forward to afterwards, which is like what you’re talking about. I want to retire when you get there. And it’s boring. So really, yeah, so go out of your comfort zone, you’re given lots of nuggets here. Well, speaking of books, we’ve got dotted overcoming doubts and doubters. What, what inspired you to write this and a little bit of background on that? So

Kara Goldin 21:11
I call myself an accidental entrepreneur, a muscle an accidental author. This was essentially my, my journal that I was writing over the course of many years. And what I found was a few years into starting Hant. People would ask me to come and speak and, and, you know, do keynotes, but also just do different panel discussions. Some of them were with conferences, where lots of people could come and enjoy. Others were inside of companies where I was talking to executives and, and mastermind groups as well. And I found that there were a lot of things that I had been through not only from an operational standpoint that I could share my stories, but also from a, how do you get outside of your comfort zone? How do you people would ask questions at the end, you know, saying like, Oh, what you’ve done is really courageous, or tell me how you got started or whatever. And so I would tell these stories. And then after my journal was about 600 pages, I finally was saying to a friend of mine, who’s an author of a book, that’s a nonfiction book. And I said, So how, what is the best way for me to take my notes, most of them were handwritten notes that I wouldn’t be writing on airplanes, or just late at night, because I also love to write. And I said, What’s the best way to actually bind my notes and get it out there to people? Because I think there’s a lot of people who don’t go to these conferences, or don’t work at companies that, you know, hire me to come in and share some of these, this journey. And she said, You mean write a book? I’m like, oh, no, that’s true. I don’t have time to write a book. I mean, it’s just like, why you have 600 pages, you should, you know, the biggest thing is, no one’s going to read a 600 page book, you probably need to take it down to that. So that was kind of the original thinking. And that was about five years ago. And it took me a couple years to actually get it out the door. The key thing that I found was actually getting an editor that could really take my writing and, and edit it down and pull out the stories that were, you know, really critical. And because there were so many stories and so part of the reason you and I met on on LinkedIn that part of the reason why I write so much is I have a lot more stories, right. And I have a lot of I’m also I’ve also believed that a lot of the stories even the ones that weren’t included in the book can really help people to get through challenging times and hard days. I found when I was first starting hand, especially most of my network was not doing what I was doing. They were they were attack. They were, you know, working inside of America Online, or CNN or Apple. And so when I’m starting a beverage company, I found like, I was an outsider to so many people in the beverage industry and some of the stories that I talked about in the book. It relates to that right like it’s like you can’t many people I didn’t have credibility because I hadn’t worked at Coke or Pepsi or Nestle and So, and again, like, you know, it wasn’t because these were people were necessarily bad people, they just, that’s what they believed they believed that you had to it, there’s just no way that somebody could start a company if they hadn’t been trained. And the reality is in every single industry that, you know, most of the great ideas, most of the transformational ideas, categories within an industry actually come from people who are consumers that are interested and in starting something, especially an idea that’s never been out there. That is, that is solving a problem for them. And initially, and they just can’t believe that it is an out there. And so then they go try. So it’s not the experience people that you necessarily need to worry about. Yes, the people who are hungry enough who are creative enough or willing and crazy enough to actually go and start something that they can’t get it out of their head.

Michael Morrison 26:12
Yeah. Now that’s that’s a great point. Because I share with business owners if money is your only only objective, you’re probably not going to hit the mark. It’s about that passion. It’s about that learning experience about the failures and things like that in small business and I just interviewed another dear friend of mine that’s on LinkedIn. I think you all are connected but Erica Rankin she’s a inspiring up and coming female entrepreneur. She’s in Canada. She Her story is similar to yours. So you accidentally kind of created flavored water based on your

Kara Goldin 26:47
flavored water. Yes, yes. And

Michael Morrison 26:51
she was in bodybuilding. And so for those that don’t know, if you’re in competition, you have to report to your coach every day, your the calories, the protein, and she loves cookie dough. So she just like I can’t do without cookie does. So she just started making a healthy dose of cookie dough, put it in her freezer, similar to your story. Somebody said, hey, you need to start selling that. And as she is. And she’s in Canada, she’s looking to launch this into 2023 or early 24 into the United States. And so she’s a she’s got lots of questions, but she’s learning it was an accident. And so your story is similar. And she’s driving around in the back of her Jeep handing out, you know, Brodo, cookie dough, edible, healthy cookie dough. And she has a question like many people on the food and beverage do and since you’ve already been here, if you don’t mind answering this. So she’s always wondering, like, should I hire a sales broker? Before I scale to scale? Or how did you do that? Or what point did you bring on a sales broker to represent you? Did you find that time of investment? Best for hint? Yeah,

Kara Goldin 27:57
I mean, I think it just depends. But you have to, I believe, get traction first. So it’s a you know, the hardest thing for an entrepreneur is you’ve got this great idea, right? And maybe somebody gives you this, this hope, right? That that this idea could really become something and maybe consumers are starting to buy your product, the the hopefully they’re starting to buy your product or your service. But the interesting thing is, is that I think that it’s it’s kind of a combination of, and it mostly boils down to the fact that you’re overwhelmed. You’re tired as a founder, right? And so all of a sudden, this idea comes in your head, like, you know, we can save you we can we can go and sell this for you. The reality is that I think you, you only hire these people, because maybe they can scale your business and all of these things, but you hire these people, because you don’t have time to do it. You’re trying to duplicate yourself, that doesn’t mean that you’re not continuing to do it. Because especially in the early days, having a founder having somebody who really has passion, and and is able to articulate why they’re actually getting started. I think it’s super, super key. So the frustration, I think for many founders when they hire brokers or a sales team, is that, you know, they’re not doing it as well as you weren’t doing it. Right. And and they probably won’t, right. They don’t have the same passion and ideas. Maybe they’ve got connections that you don’t have. But I think that the way to get around that is that you never stopped selling right? You’re The founder, you’re the visionary, you’re the reason why this product is where it is. Right? And you need to be able to, you know, stay in the game, maybe you’re not doing it every day. But you have to stay connected. Otherwise, it just doesn’t work.

Michael Morrison 30:19
Yeah, that’s good advice. So, with that, when you’re building a business or scaling a business, there’s a lot of doubts and fears. What are some of those that you talk about? In an undaunted? And also was there any? I know, with a lot of small businesses, we have a blocked mindset from something in our early childhood, what maybe it’s self worth or traumatic event, parents divorced, died or something? What what are some of those things that you talk about? And how can people overcome those?

Kara Goldin 30:49
Well, I think the key thing to think what the there’s a couple of different questions there, which one?

Michael Morrison 31:01
I’m just full of them. So the the mindset overcoming mindset, I guess, would be a good start.

Kara Goldin 31:07
I think that the key thing is, and I think it goes back to really the the last question around the journey, the early days of starting your company, you know, you’re getting started, you’re, you’re working harder than you’ve ever worked in your life, because you’re starting a product from nothing, you’re constantly explaining it, you’re constantly dealing with all of the details to actually get it off the ground and, and get traction. And I think that the the, after a while, those those doubters around you start to feed in to your own doubts, right? Because you’re thinking, I’ve never worked this hard, maybe it’s actually not working. Maybe that’s why things are so hard. Because if things are really hard, doesn’t that mean? That it’s not supposed to be? Right, right? But the reality is, is that when you’re spending a lot of time sharing this idea with people, and it’s an idea, or a product that they’ve never seen before, and that was our situation with unsweetened water yet, on the other side of the table for me, from the people that were actually saying yes, to put it on the shelf to manufacturers, to you know, consumers to people in the industry, they were all kind of coming at me, right saying like, this is never going to work. It wouldn’t be this hard. If it was really going to work Coke and Pepsi would have launched this product or ready if it was suppose if it was going to be like, a big deal. Yeah. And, and so after a while, I think because you’re tired, right? Yes, very you start, you’re like, Okay, maybe they’re right, maybe I shouldn’t be doing this, why am I doing this, I could make a lot more money. Going back into tech, I could have a lot less hours, you know, put into working lots of things, but I’m not going to be creating anything anymore. And so you almost have to go back and and kind of defend your own doubts. Right? And, and because the, the weight of other people’s doubts coming in, at some point starts to make you feel like they’re ganging up on you. And maybe you should just throw in the towel. And I think that that’s a very, very real consideration. For for many founders in any industry and small business owners as well.

Michael Morrison 33:58
Yeah. And a lot of times it takes sometimes it can just take one defining moment. I know for you and your book, what were you called? And one of those execs office was it sweetie or babe or? Yes,

Kara Goldin 34:10
Sweetie, sweetie. Yeah. And he was senior executive at that little soda company in Atlanta. And you know, it was a friend connected us together primarily because I was having one of those days where I was like, This is so hard. I can’t figure this problem out. I was trying to figure out how to actually bottle a product without without preservatives in it. A bottle. You know, can’t doesn’t have sweeteners in it. But it has fruit in the product. So no one was actually creating a beverage with fruit in it. That was a water product that didn’t have didn’t have preservatives in it. And so when I asked people, the manufacturers that lot of CO packers around the country, if if they could do this product without preservatives, that was part of my specs, they said, it’s impossible. So I finally had heard that word impossible so many times. And I was sharing with a friend, that we’ve gotten some traction early on. But we’re barely staying in Whole Foods primarily because we needed a longer shelf life. And in order to have the shelf life, we needed to add preservatives in it, according to lots of people. But no one can really ask answer the question why? When I asked them. And so finally, she connected she knew somebody at Coca Cola. And I reached out, and she connected me and we had a call. And I think the initial meeting with the gentleman at Coca Cola was, perhaps to find out, like, why, right, I had asked a lot of people, but maybe he knew he had been in Coca Cola for many years, and had also done a lot of operations. And so maybe he knew, but probably a few days before this call was coming up, I had this idea that maybe I could just sell the company to them. Like, maybe I could just give them a company. I mean, at this point, I was just trying to cut my losses, right, because I was exhausted, I was putting my own personal money into the company. And not seeing, you know, where the light was going to be. Right and, and how soon it was going to come. And so when he when we had a very nice initial, you know, 15 minutes, I was kind of selling him on the idea of like, how great the company was. And he interrupted me about 15 minutes in and said, Sweetie, Americans love sweet this product isn’t going anywhere. Wow. And I didn’t even get a chance to like, offer him the company or talk to him about purchasing it. I didn’t even have an opportunity to ask him about like, Do you know why? Instead, I was so like, put off shaken by the fact that this very senior person who’s like, you know, should know everything about beverages was telling me that my company wasn’t going anywhere, and that consumers really liked sweetened products. And he started that conversation by saying, sweetie, and I was like, for the first five minutes, I thought he just call me sweetie. I have never been called sweetie before in my life. But, but it’s interesting. I think my reaction to that, though, was, again, like I didn’t wake up that morning thinking that I was going to be called sweetie, I also didn’t wake up that morning, think being that I would have this reaction to it. I thought I can do a couple different things. With that comment. I can hang up the phone. I could, I could be angry about it. I could. I could stay on the line and try and understand why he thinks what he thinks. Yeah. And that’s what I did. And so we continue to have a conversation for about 45 minutes, he did most of the talking. And what I found was that I was actually learning his strategy. And what he believed this consumer, he did millions of dollars worth of research, which I hadn’t done. And he was sharing why he believed what he believed. Now, I disagreed. I didn’t see all the data, but I disagreed with what he was saying because I was his consumer. I had drank Diet Coke for many, many years, thinking that the word diet was actually getting me healthy, like most people do, like most people do. And that idea, that interpretation of language pushed me into an addiction of diet sweeteners. And I never viewed myself as as having an addiction to diet sweeteners. Until one day I woke up when I was really focused on my own my actually my kids health even before my own health, and I thought you know So crazy, I’m trying to limit sugar that I’m giving my kids initially with juice I was trying to cut back on, on juice my little ones at that time. And, and I thought, I thought I’m a hypocrite, like, Here I am, like I’m having sweet, but I’m having diet sweeteners, I didn’t feel like it was a great idea to give my kids diet sweeteners. But I felt like they weren’t going to have regular water because it’s boring. I always thought plain water was really boring. So that’s when I started slicing of fruit and throwing it in the water. And, and it was at that moment, when, you know, I had been through that little journey, I thought, here’s, there’s a problem out there that I don’t think I’m the only one that has this problem. There’s multiple problems with other people being confused by this term diet. But in addition to that, I think if there was this alternative product that was out there, that would help a lot of people you could give it, I would drink it, I could give it to my kids and their sippy cups. Like, there were lots of different scenarios that I could see without even doing any research. And here this gentleman was telling me that this didn’t exist. And I thought, I don’t know. And then I would take my drink that I created in my kitchen, and I would go to the park or I would go to the gym. And everyone was asking me what kind of fruit I had my water I had a clear bottle. Yeah. And they would see like a pomegranate in the in the bottle. And people would say, what do you have in your water? And I’m like, uh, today I have raspberry and apples. And they’re like, that’s such a great idea. Like, does it have any sugar in it? No, just whatever’s in the fruit. Right? And they said, Wow, you don’t add anything else to it. I’ve got to try that. And I thought, why isn’t somebody making it so much easier? Yeah, well, to have this product. And the last thing I’ll say is after that, sweetie, and after him sharing what he believed was what the consumer wanted. That’s when I hung up the phone, I think he probably thought that, you know, he had taken a chess piece off that. I was not he didn’t even consider me in the game, right? Like, he was just like, Okay, I did my phone call with this crazy woman and Marin County, and now she’s gone. But what I thought is, eventually, he’s gonna get it. He’s gonna He’s gonna get it. And he has more money than I do. And he’s going to be able to go faster than I am. And so I’ve got to throw the foot on the gas or quit. Right? That’s the other option. But I thought I, it was like, it was like a light bulb went off in my head, because I just thought he doesn’t get it and this product will not be out there. If he doesn’t believe it will not be out there. Yeah, through Him. And so I need to do what I need to develop this product, if I really want a product like this out there on the market for consumers to help them drink water, right, that are without sweeteners.

Michael Morrison 43:43
Yeah, so he just added fuel to the fire is what he did. He

Kara Goldin 43:47
did. And you know, that’s happened to me in multiple instances, not just with the actual product, but how we deliver the product. I mean, the number of people in 2012, who said to me in the beverage industry and in the food industry to that, that you can’t deliver heavy cases of water to people, right through a direct to consumer model, right. And no one was really doing it successfully. And when I saw that our product actually was selling on Amazon. That gave me the courage, I guess to know that there’s no there’s actually people that are starting to buy food and buy drinks online. We became we did a test there. We became the number one product in Amazon grocery pretty really. Yeah, it was crazy. And again, like people were shocked they were like, oh, there’s no way I mean, Amazon has all these has all these savings, you know because of volumes and this and this And I thought, maybe that’s true. But you know, we’re definitely, you know, doing great business for Amazon. Now, about a year into working with Amazon, that’s when I was up in the Seattle offices, hearing from everybody, including our main investor that, you know, why are we why are we doing this? Like, this is crazy that we’re actually delivering cases like, shouldn’t we be supporting retailers, and I kept saying, you know, you’ve got to support the consumer, because the consumer is choosing to shop this way for other products, and they will be shopping this way. They’re already showing us the early signs, the early days of, of shopping for food and beverage products. The key thing that I saw on that meeting up in Seattle that day was that the we would not get the emails from Amazon. And so so there was this even having worked in tech for a long time. The I had sort of forgotten about Amazon being a retailer, right? For me, there were still a way for us to sell products online. And so I was given a, a very thorough explanation by the Amazon buyer, how Amazon is no different than Whole Foods is no different. This was before they owned Whole Foods, no different than a Starbucks or anybody else, like they have your data. It’s it’s not your data, once you actually wholesale a product to a retailer, they own the consumer experience, and what they were sharing with me about what they were seeing, but they weren’t willing to actually allow me to reach out to any of these consumers that were buying through Amazon was that they were not only buying hint in their purchases, but they were also buying other things in other categories. And that’s why they were so interested in him because it was one of the first products that crossed over, made the ring and in the shopping cart higher. So the so people were buying things like diabetes monitors, and when people were buying things like Kind bars, and when people were buying things like exercise equipment, and so you were able to kind of see a, you were able to see sort of the profile of who this consumer was that they were healthy, or they wanted health. Maybe they were trying to fix a health issue, whatever these issues were. And, you know, that was my reason for starting the company. And so I was very curious. They weren’t going to give me the data. And that’s when I went back to San Francisco that evening and shared with my my husband, our chief operating officer that we need to start our own online store. And there were many doubters at that point. But I said, we’re, there’s plenty of room. It’s we’re not competing against Amazon, we are servicing the consumer. And but again, like when you have these glimpses when you have these times when, you know, maybe the other side of the table isn’t exactly telling you what you want. You have to say, what can we do? What can I do? Yeah, right. What is my goal? My goal is to support consumers. Well, Plan A isn’t going to work. So What’s plan B? And how am I going to make that happen? Yeah,

Michael Morrison 49:02
now that’s, that’s golden advice. Because for most small business owners, we’re always worried about what people think about us versus what our consumers care about. And so we kind of get off, you know, focus. And so that’s a that’s a very valuable information. I know, we only had so much time scheduled where I can’t believe we’re out of time. Any last words of wisdom advice, tips that you could give small business owners to take their business to another level?

Kara Goldin 49:31
I think it’s really important to find time to think, right, I think oftentimes, we get into operating the day to day and, and kind of going through the grind going through the hustle of, of making sure that we’re, you know, growing sales, we’re increasing profitability, all of those things, but I think often what I find is most helpful is actually scheduling out time to just think, right? And spend time maybe that thinking is actually, you know, talking to your customers sitting on a customer service line, if you happen to have that as part of your small business or spending time in stores, right, that’s where you’re able to kind of get close to the consumer, and hear what they’re saying, you sometimes don’t even have to ask any questions. Right, you can see how they, you know, navigate your site? Or what kind of questions are they asking what what isn’t totally clear? Where else do they shop? Right? What What else are they doing? All of these kinds of things will help you to make decisions around what else is needed? What else can you do to really service this consumer? And I think so often we’re, you know, we’re in the hamster wheel, we’re trying to keep up versus actually trying to figure out, you know, sit back and think a little bit, and really schedule that time. And I find myself even getting into that hamster wheel, right, where you’re just constantly going, versus actually trying to schedule that time. And I think that that is probably a great reminder, for for people that, you know, maybe are feeling overwhelmed or just trying to keep up. It’s like, if you can actually get a grip on you know, who your consumer. What is your consumer thinking? What are they doing? What else are they doing? What are trends that are really important? How did somebody else handle a problem? That That seems similar to yours? Maybe that maybe that’s exactly what you need in order to figure out how to move forward.

Michael Morrison 52:10
Yeah, that’s, that’s solid. I always say you got to take care of number one first, because no one else will. And you’re just confirming that So, Kara, keep on impacting the world, businesses, people, consumers, health, all that good stuff. I look forward to seeing how far further you go. And if you’re not connected, or following Kara, please do on LinkedIn, very inspiring every day, and we’ll talk to you soon.

Kara Goldin 52:35
Thank you so much.

Michael Morrison 52:37
Thank you. I like to end our shows, with a coaching moment where I can recap the show, maybe hit some bullet points that our guest has spoken about. And then also leave you with action items. So you’re getting free business coaching. If you want real business coaching, go to my page, Michael D morrison.com. And in the upper right hand corner, there’s a let’s chat button. Let’s have a conversation first. You can also find out more about how business coaching can help you for today’s show care. It was very inspiring and, and impactful. She shared that all businesses, all businesses have failures. All businesses have pivots. It’s finding the solutions that can take your business to the next level. As Richard Branson says, a big business start small. You heard it first from Kara Goldin who worked at some of these big well known companies, America Online, Ted Turner companies, Jeff Bezos company, match. She didn’t work for all these, but she was associated with them in some capacity. And as she described, every business has its trials and tribulations, you just have to be able to overcome those. And my coaching moment for today for small business owners is to look for your inspiration. If money is your only object, it’s more than likely you probably won’t, past that money target. Because once you’ve succeeded at that target, what else is there to lift for to keep pushing and plowing forward? As I mentioned before, in the show, most small business owners that we work with when they put a target only have a million dollars. Once they get there. They’re like I thought it would feel different. And it doesn’t. It’s just another milestone. So your action item today is find your inspiration. Hers was being called sweetie. That’s one of In other words, she didn’t say it. And I’m not going to put words in her mouth. But it sounds like that was her defining moment of all show you watch and see. My defining moment was in high school. When we were asked from the teacher, what do you want to be when you grow up? And I mentioned entrepreneur. She asked what type of entrepreneur and I said I want to landscape homes, gardens, and the most popular kid in class yelled out, I wouldn’t let you landscape My dog house and of course, everybody laughed. Except for me. That was over three decades ago. And that’s still my inspiration. Because that’s the perspective that I thought others had of me, as well as myself. And so I wanted to prove them wrong. So your action item is to go find your inspiration. Find that defining moment that sets you on fire. And then secondly, make a plan. And don’t just stop at a million dollars, or five or 10. Think about in 10 years from now, what kind of lifestyle do you want to have, and then build a business around that it’s possible that you could build a huge business and possibly not run it. You can hire a CEO. The opportunities are endless as you’ve heard from Kara. But as Kara said, you just have to overcome those doubts and doubters. We’ll see you next time.

Kara Goldin 55:56
Before we sign off, I want to talk to you about fear. People like to talk about fearless leaders. But achieving big goals isn’t about fearlessness. Successful leaders recognize their fears and decide to deal with them head on in order to move forward. This is where my new book undaunted comes in. This book is designed for anyone who wants to succeed in the face of fear, overcome doubts and live a little undaunted. Order your copy today at undaunted, the book.com and learn how to look your doubts and doubters in the eye and achieve your dreams. For a limited time. You’ll also receive a free case of hint water. Do you have a question for me or want to nominate an innovator to spotlight send me a tweet at Kara Goldin and let me know. And if you liked what you heard, please leave me a review on Apple podcasts. You can also follow along with me on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter and LinkedIn at Kara Goldin. Thanks for listening