Debbie Mullin: Founder & CEO of Copper Cow Coffee

Episode 737

On this episode of The Kara Goldin Show, we’re joined by Debbie Mullin, Founder & CEO of Copper Cow Coffee — the premium Vietnamese coffee brand on a mission to modernize and elevate the traditional Vietnamese coffee experience for U.S. consumers. What began as an idea to merge her Vietnamese heritage with a commitment to ethical sourcing and innovative design has grown into the leading Vietnamese coffee brand in America. Copper Cow is now a national favorite, found in over 3,000 retail doors including Target, Whole Foods, Costco, and H-E-B, and beloved for its signature single-serve pour overs, bold flavors, and all-natural creamers.
In our conversation, Debbie shares how she built Copper Cow from the ground up, the challenges of educating U.S. consumers about Vietnamese coffee, and how she positioned the brand to stand out in a crowded coffee market. We talk about her bold bets on design, direct farmer partnerships in Vietnam, and why she believes Vietnamese coffee is poised to take off globally. Debbie also opens up about her entrepreneurial journey, her Shark Tank experience, and the lessons she’s learned about balancing authenticity, innovation, and rapid growth.
Whether you’re a coffee lover, a mission-driven entrepreneur, or someone curious about building a brand that bridges cultures and categories, this episode is full of insights you won’t want to miss. Now on The Kara Goldin Show.

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Transcript

Kara Goldin 0:00
I am unwilling to give up, that I will start over from scratch as many times as it takes to get where I want to be. I want to be you. Just want to make sure you will get knocked down. But just make sure you don’t get knocked out, knocked out. So your only choice should be go focus on what you can control. Control, control. Hi everyone, and welcome to the Kara Goldin show. Join me each week for inspiring conversations with some of the world’s greatest leaders. We’ll talk with founders, entrepreneurs, CEOs and really, some of the most interesting people of our time. Can’t wait to get started. Let’s go. Let’s go. Hi everyone, and welcome back to the Kara Goldin Show. Today. We’re diving into one of my favorite industries, coffee, but not just any coffee. My guest today has been working to reimagine Vietnamese coffee for the modern consumer while building a brand that’s as mission driven as it is delicious. Debbie Mullin is the founder and CEO of Copper Cow Coffee, the leading premium Vietnamese coffee brand in the US. And since 2017 Copper Cow has grown from a direct to consumer favorite into a national retail brand with a presence in Target Whole Foods, Costco, H, E, B, plenty of shelf space with innovative single serve pour overs, real flavored coffees and all natural creamers. So Copper Cow is modernizing the Vietnamese coffee experience, while also creating economic opportunities for farmers in Vietnam. So I cannot wait to hear more about Debbie’s journey, spanning from working at the World Bank to blending her Vietnamese heritage with her passion for entrepreneurship, clearly a mission driven company, but a delicious company, and I love the packets. They are so great. You have huge fans in our house, and while doing it with authenticity, clean ingredients and bold design. So I’m very excited to be chatting with you here today. Debbie, thank you so much for coming on.

Debbie Mullin 2:23
Thank you so much for having me, and thank you for that is like the most wonderful introduction I’ve ever had. It’s so sweet, especially, like it says, I mean, it’s like a ton coming from you and hearing that like you and your family are a fan of of the packaging and the concept. And, you know, because I’ve, I’ve definitely, like, looked at hint water as, like a major North Star as I launched my brand. So just just the feeling is very mutual around brand. Love.

Kara Goldin 2:48
Oh, thank you. I really, really appreciate it. So okay, well, let’s start with with the simple when someone picks up a Copper Cow Coffee packet, maybe, how do you describe it to people? What are they buying into? What are they going to receive? Why is this different, and why is this needed?

Debbie Mullin 3:08
I think that that’s something that I’ve always struggled with since starting the company, because we have there’s like, I’m always like, Can I have a paragraph description? And any marketer I’ve ever hired is like, it has to be, like, three words. But I think that if you talk about picking up a packet, I think that there’s a couple things that are so exciting about it. I mean, I think that first and foremost, it’s always about the coffee, and that’s like, how you have to start if it’s not gonna taste good, like, I can’t get excited to sell it. And that’s always been something that’s been really core to the company. And so we’ve been working with farmers now for for nine years, being able to kind of invest in how Vietnamese coffee is cultivated, the way that it’s roasted, everything from the farm all the way into the way that you drink it. And that’s why, what’s so exciting that which is like the experience that you’re going to have firsthand with the packet, is, is that it’s just the most it’s the best way to have an easy cup of coffee. And I think that, you know, I’ve always really struggled with with pods, because it is putting lukewarm water into a plastic cup, and it’s going to affect the taste. It’s going to, no matter what kind of quality of coffee you put in there, it’s going to be challenging versus this pour over can fit over any cup, and it’s completely turnkey. It’s so easy for you to have. And I think that what’s when, what’s it’s great to be able to taste everything that we’ve done in the farms and everything that we’ve done with our flavors, because, like, the way that we flavor coffee is also really unique. And that’s what’s exciting, exciting about launching kind of these singles. Now we’re going to be selling these singles. They’re actually just on shelf in the last two weeks, on in target. So we’re selling them for $1.39 each. So it’s like, what does real cinnamon taste like in coffee? Like if you brew it in directly? And how exciting that is, that someone can try it for $1.39 because right now, coffee. Prices are going crazy, and it’s kind of intimidating to be like, should I spend $18 on a bag of coffee to try something new and be stuck with it for a month? And so we’re really excited to be able to have, like, it’s this format that is so convenient, but you get to taste all this effort that we’ve put in for this last decade. And I’m excited for people

Kara Goldin 5:19
to try it. I love it. So when you had gone from working at the World Bank to starting Copper Cow, so can you talk to me about that decision? What I mean, how did you come up with this idea? It’s one thing to love Vietnamese coffee. It’s another thing to say, I’m going to go and start a company around it.

Debbie Mullin 5:44
I think that, I think what, I think a lot of entrepreneurs can relate in that I don’t know if it ever felt like a decision. It just felt like it’s just kind of all I could think about. And it’s funny having kids now where, like, they get a special interest, like my son, he’s like, just into cars, and that’s like, all he wants to be into. And how much I see, like, that’s like, who I am with what I do. And I think that I was working at the World Bank, and if you’re working at the World Bank, that means, like, your major interest is bureaucracy. And that’s like, No, that is not a happy place for me to be in. That’s something that was really hard for me to be. That was where 90% of my effort was being put into. Is like, if you want something to happen, if you’re excited about something, the World Bank’s mission is reducing poverty, and a lot of that is through government loans, and how you have to spend all your time thinking about how you’re just going to get the paperwork to work to make something happen, and that’s that was just really hard for me, and I think that I don’t even know if I was the right person to do it, because I was constantly told that I was impatient. I was constantly told that I didn’t know my place. And I think that it’s really nice to have chosen a different career path where that attitude is rewarded and and kind of, you know, is, is like, applauded, almost. And so I think that when I started to think about, you know, what could I do that really services that same goal of creating better opportunities in Vietnam, which is where my family’s from, you know, I first went there in 96 as a teenager. And just like, couldn’t believe that that was where my mom was from, both in terms of, like, realizing that there was a whole country of people that was just like her and my family. But then also just looking at the extreme poverty, you know, and the poverty rate has gone from 60% to 19% it’s the country has completely changed, and I would like to think that Copper Cow gets to be part of that change of bringing better opportunities with the way that we cultivate coffee and the way that we pay farmers, the way that we pay all of our manufacturers and everything along the way. And so when I started to realize that Vietnam was the second largest coffee producer in the world. And just knowing, through all the work that I’ve done at the World Bank around how commodity extraction is is just really kind of is can be really harmful, and about how having value added, you know, development in supply chains and country or is one of the biggest ways to create opportunity and wealth and, you know, reduce poverty in countries that that a business like this could really be impactful, and that, you know, I’m, I’m Vietnamese American. My dad is a big, a big coffee head. You know, I grew up in in Mill Valley, California, drinking specialty coffee with my dad and watching him be obsessed with that my whole life. And then on my mom’s side, you know, getting to know Vietnamese coffee and how and Vietnamese cuisine, and how exciting that was. And so the idea of being able to merge those two worlds felt like something that I could translate better than anybody else. So once I started to kind of see that vision, it was all I could think about, you know. And so it was like every evening, every weekend, you know, to the point where finally I, like, I realized that the only way to do this was to do it full time, and so I raised friends and family money. But I don’t even remember. I can’t tell you the specific like, that was the day that I decided to do it. It just was more like, you know, I do remember I told my parents after I had quit the World Bank, because I was too afraid to tell them leading up to the decision, but I think that it was, I remember that that moment a little bit more, I think, but it’s just an obsession, and it’s something that is still captivates me today.

Kara Goldin 9:33
It sounds like you, you know, had this experience with the World Bank, really understanding different communities throughout the world, not just Vietnamese, but you know, lots of different areas throughout the world, but you thought that by starting Copper Cow, you could actually help the farmers and help society in this world, while also creating some economic. Uh, benefits of some sort. But what? What was stronger were you? Were you feeling like, I can help a lot of people, or I really want to get a great cup of coffee on on store shelves, because there’s both are okay, right? But I think it’s, it’s such a powerful um for anybody starting a mission driven company, as you have, there’s, there’s always this, you know, Yin and Yang that goes on, yeah,

Debbie Mullin 10:29
I would definitely say the desire to start a company was number one. Like I was, I was in this mode of being, like, Here, here’s like, 10 bad business ideas and asking people out to lunch, and you know that might know a little bit about what I might want to do, so that they could tell me how bad of an idea was, though, I would say that this was an idea that each time I took someone out to lunch, they’d be like, someone should do this. Like, what you’re thinking of is a really great idea to modernize Vietnamese coffee into that that there is, like, a huge impact, and that there is a potential market for it, and that there are people who seem to have been thinking about it, but there just hasn’t been much follow through, you know. And so I think that, like, it was really about this idea of, like, I really want to start a company. I do think that that’s going to fit my personality, and I can’t imagine a situation where that company could get me out of bed and work the hours I need to work, if there wasn’t a mission element to it, right? And so that was kind of the first part of, like, knowing what I was going to do and and I think that the third part, which was kind of more opportunistic, is that I am a huge foodie, and I love coffee. And, you know, I do think that I have an eye for those kinds of things, right? And so I think being able to say, I know what’s really special about Vietnamese food, and I know it’s really special about Vietnamese coffee, but I also understand the palette of, like, the American so, like, how do I, what’s, how do I really kind of connect those two things? And thinking about how wait like that is something that I think that I would be uniquely positioned for, that would service the first two things, right, that that was really the North Star of what I was trying to do when I was thinking about the exit from the World Bank,

Kara Goldin 12:14
what was your first step in actually launching, I mean, beyond quitting your Job and deciding I’m going to go all in, what were did you get on a plane and go to Vietnam and start trying to see what you could do?

Debbie Mullin 12:31
The first step was, I actually wanted to start with a ready to drink, because that was, like nine years ago. What was like, just beginning to get big was like, cold brew coffee bottled Right? Was a totally new trend and very exciting. So I actually first went to the store and, just like, bought all the Vietnamese coffees that were available, and then I formulated a like, the best tasting one that I could and then I I printed out like label, like my own labels, and then I just gave them to friends and family. And then I did a, like, a focus group at a we work, which I was renting office space out of when I was working as a full time consultant at the World Bank. So just, kind of just being like, let’s just see if people would even want it if I gave it away for free, and that they would talk about it afterwards and ask about it, right? So I think it was just, I’m a big product person, like being like, if it’s something that I’m excited to serve somebody, isn’t that going to be kind of the first step? And then even more, is the person going to afterwards be like, When can you make that again? When are you going to give me more of that? Can I buy it? Where can I buy it? And getting that kind of feedback the second then then I began to then, I think the second step was, like, was in tandem. I said, Okay, well, how do I actually manufacture this so you’re allowed to sell it, which was, as you can imagine, as someone who’s gone through that process themselves, such a rabbit hole of learning that a lot of the things that I wanted to do weren’t going to be possible around I said, Oh, I want it to be clean label and be shelf stable and all these things. And learned, you know, very quickly, how how hard of an industry this was, and how hard it was to formulate or ready to drink. But I also knew that the agriculture side of it was going to be the thing that was going to be mission driven about it, right? So I did get on a plane and go with my family to Vietnam, on a trip that was kind of half work, half half visiting the family that remains there. And that was when I was really blown away with that. I really thought that agriculturally, that that people were really excited about this concept, and that I was getting, I was finding people who were willing to support me and be partners in a lot of the the ways that we would grow the coffee and cultivate the coffee differently. So I felt like that was really ready, but the ready to drink formulation is not so what’s what’s the path forward? You know, do we just sell bags of coffee? And then I discovered the pour over format, and it was really popular in Asia. It wasn’t here. You know, I’m always been really obsessed with, like, the Red Bull, you know, like, case study of it being, like, this popular Thai product that was brought here. Or a good friend of mine started mighty patch, bringing pimple patches over here, like, you bringing something that’s really common in Asia to to the US market, and making it for the US consumer. And I got so excited about it, especially when I thought about how, you know, I could create a single serve, you know, sweetened condensed milk, creamer and that together would give you the perfect Vietnamese coffee. And again, you don’t need any equipment. You don’t need to know anything, and it’s really affordable. There’s just a way that you can make it at home. And I knew that this would be a really fun e commerce product, which, at the time, people weren’t really buying food and beverage online, so it was just kind of saying, like, that must be coming, right? So this could be the product that we sell online, you know, not knowing that the world would would become what it is that this was before Instacart, you know, even existed and everything, right? So, yeah. So that was kind of how, how the supply chain and the product came together was through a lot of missteps, but a lot of being in the right place, in the right time, in terms of Vietnam, which continues, I think, to be the right place in the right time to be for specialty coffee.

Kara Goldin 16:15
So when you were giving it away inside the we work and getting, you know, people to try it. What was the point where you actually opened your store, where you started really getting serious about starting your website, your store? I mean, how long did that take before you finally said, I’m ready

Debbie Mullin 16:41
so so September was when I went to Vietnam. I remember it was a September, and then I had bought a booth thinking that, thinking that I would have this ready to drink, because I had, I knew that I was going to do go exhibit at the Fancy Food Show, and that was how I was going to get into stores. Because, again, e commerce wasn’t a really big thing, so you still thought that, like getting into stores would be the still the number one thing. And so I had a fancy food booth booked for January. So I was like, I have to somehow formulate something. And I remember in December, we did a run of the RTD Kara. It just like coagulated. It was disgusting. There was like, no way it could possibly be sold. But I’d already paid for this booth, so I’m like, What am I? I need to use it. And I luckily had had branded samples of the pour overs made. And so I spent two weeks calling every single sachet provider being like, can you even just make me a Copper Cow looking ketchup packet and just put ketchup in there? Like, just, make it like and I found somebody who would that in two weeks, put condensed milk in a sachet for me. They gave me 10 units. So I had 20. I had 20 poor overs, and I had 10 sweet condensed milk. I remember by the end of the show, we only had two of each. We were just holding them and being like, don’t let go, because you know how people like, are handsy and like, steal samples from you at those shows. So I just had this prototype, and I remember them coming up to me with this piece of paper on the third day of the show. And was like, You’ve been chosen as a top five innovation of the whole show out of the 1500 products. Here you are a top five like this. No one’s ever seen something like this before, like the taste the innovation there. And there was a wonderful ceremony, and we got into 1500 stores from that show. And it just felt like, I mean, I just then, then it’s just, how quickly can I actually get this manufactured? Like, at this point, I don’t even, I don’t even have a real way to manufacture it, you know. So we were able to get it to to market in April. So we launched our store, we did pre sales, and then we were able to start shipping it out to those customers, those fit for 1500 doors in April. And you know, it’s just been kind of crazy ever since.

Kara Goldin 18:56
How many SKUs did you then kind of officially launch with, and how does that differ from today?

Debbie Mullin 19:03
So we had one skew, so it was just what we called a latte pack, and it had five coffees and five creamers in it. And so you can make 555, lattes with it. And I thought it sounds like five, there’s five weekdays in the week. You know? It’s like, how do you choose these things? They’re so funny, right? There’s five weekdays in the week what’s and we can bake it for $15 which seems like a reasonable price. And so we were able to launch it with that. And then our second SKU we ever made was a Thai tea kit, which was really similar, but with Thai tea, and we didn’t really see it do much for our E commerce business. But then, when we launched a lavender coffee, which was our first flavored coffee, where we put lavender sprigs into the pour over itself, it was such a nightmare trying to get someone to actually do this, as opposed to spraying on an essence. And that overnight, doubled our business, you know, just immediately, and that’s when we’ve we really started to take on flavors. And. The day, we carry three core flavors. We always launch a few seasonal flavors in holiday and we’re always bringing seasonal flavors, like the lavender back into stock. And that’s been a huge driver of how we’ve grown the brand is educating people about how different real flavors taste in coffee, and kind of reinventing flavored coffee from there, and we do sell whole bags of those coffees now. And that’s been probably the biggest growth of our company, because people love the way it tastes so much. And that’s that represents the fastest growing part of the business, is the bags of coffee, in addition to the pour overs.

Kara Goldin 20:35
I love the lavender coffee that you guys do. It’s so, so good. So it’s, it’s and it’s not something that is like, I at first, I had to think about exactly what it was going to taste like, and when I tried it, I was like, wow, this really is unique. And what you guys have done, you can really tell that it’s, you know, quality ingredients, you’re not using flavorings or, you know, it’s just, you guys have really nailed it. So coffee is such a crowded space, and obviously Vietnamese coffee is different and and unique. It tastes different. It’s from a different part of the world than many of the coffees that we see out there. But, but how do you educate the consumer to know what they’re going to get? And I feel like that’s always especially when you’re doing something that’s unique, you’re really driving this category, right, of Vietnamese coffee in the US. But I mean, that’s good and bad, because when you don’t have that much competition, then it’s, you know, it’s all up to you to sort of grow it in, in a way, and get people to really understand why they should even try

Debbie Mullin 21:52
it. I think that Copper Cow has been just the an ultimate like master class and knowing your customer. Because I think that there’s, you know, Vietnamese coffee. It’s the second largest coffee producer in the world. Clearly, like people are drinking Vietnamese coffee, and either they don’t know it, or it’s something that I thought when I first launched Copper Cow, was that Copper Cows job was re education, you know, because people who work in coffee, you know, had Vietnamese coffee has such a bad had such a bad rap to it. It was really synonymous with the cheapest commodity coffee. It was synonymous with instant coffee. And how do you re educate around that experience? And I think that that was what I thought we had to do. And then, you know, one year in, we realized that no, the thing is, no one has heard of Vietnamese coffee because I grew up in the Bay Area, you know, where there is a pretty large Asian population, and how Vietnamese coffee is something that someone’s come into contact with, probably at a Vietnamese restaurant or even in a cafe. And then just realizing that, you know, we don’t want to sell to Vietnamese people. We don’t want to sell to someone who’s been to Vietnam. We want to sell to somebody who just loves coffee and who loves, you know, a dark roasted, full bodied, chocolatey, nutty undertone coffee, which is what Vietnam does best, and when it cultivated correctly. And we also love sweetened condensed milk. We think sweetened condensed milk is like the best shelf stable creamer out there, like, throw out the coffee mates, like this is going to be something that’s way cleaner and way more delicious, and so we like to define it both those ways, right? And I think that that’s been really challenging to explain why, why our coffee is going to taste different, and how to expect that in such a crowded market. And same with the creamers, to explain to people that it’s not going to be a powder. It’s not going to be full of chemicals and palm oil. It’s going to be something that’s made with, like, just milk and sugar. And I think that that’s going to be how it tastes totally different. And it’s going to be a little bit more expensive, or, for the creamers, a lot more expensive, but you’re going to be able to taste a real difference. And so it has been, it’s expensive, it’s hard. It takes time. I mean, I definitely think that it’s been interesting to to realize how much education it takes when somebody’s starting from a place of just having never heard of your product. Yeah,

Kara Goldin 24:11
definitely. But you built just strong Gen Z and Millennial following. How do you think that you’ve been able to do that? Right? I feel like there’s that Gen Z and Millennial. I mean, it’s, it’s, it’s such a fickle audience, right? Like, depending on, you know, what they’re seeing on Tiktok or Snapchat or but how have you been able to kind of capture those audiences so well? I

Debbie Mullin 24:40
think that it’s, it’s two things. One is just like hiring great people, you know, you know, I think that that’s the best thing, is to be able to hire, like, really great people that are within your demographic, or who understand your demographic, and who are excited to come and be have their their point of view, valued. It’s very rare, like on my marketing team, that some. Can propose something, and I say, No, you know, I’m pretty game for whatever somebody wants to do, and I’m excited when someone wants to do something crazy. I think that that’s half of it, but the the other half is, I think that I’ve always seen there be a really big hole in the specialty coffee market for just some someone that’s going to feel a little bit more fun and whimsy about their coffee. I think people want to drink great coffee. I think people might not have the the tolerance to really like sit and know everything about that that goes into it. They but they do. They know what real flavors taste like. They know a good a good brew of coffee. They they can taste all of that. And how do you create that relationship with them, where you’re bringing bringing joy to the customer that way. And I think that that’s something that we’ve always really focused on, is that there’s like the the functional coffee drinker, and then there’s the emotional coffee drinker. And we really service the emotional coffee drinker, and we really think about, what is that moment? What’s the emotional moment that’s tied to coffee for for the Gen Z or millennial? It’s, it’s like, it’s, you know, with having coffee with friends on the weekend. It’s, it’s like, something that they’re doing, you know, to get through finals. It’s something that you’re doing, you know, in in a park. I think there’s a lot of things that you can do with Copper Cow that’s really exciting that, you know, we try to always think about what’s, what’s the emotional connection to that and and trying to think about our customers point of view there

Kara Goldin 26:28
well, and I think the function, right, like it’s, it’s a gadget, right? It to some extent too, that I think is, is, is really great what you guys have done. And I think that especially for Gen Z. And I look at my own kids, I mean, they looked at it and they were like, Oh, this is amazing, and I can take it with me, and so easy. And it also tastes really great. And you can taste the difference for sure. So every founder hears a ton of advice. What’s the best advice that you can remember as you were starting to build this, this company. I mean, it’s, it’s interesting because, you know, you had amazing experience prior to starting a company, but it’s almost like you’re, you know, glutton for punishment. You decide to go down to, you know, ground zero, and what am I doing, right? But what did somebody tell you, maybe on one of those days where you just thought, What am I doing here? This is crazy.

Debbie Mullin 27:33
I remember, like, talking with a, you know, a really seasoned, impressive founder, and I was going through, like, a really hard time, and I was, I remember just asking them, you know, how do you like, like, what do you do? What do you do when things are so hard, when you feel like every decision that you’ve made has somehow not fit the world that you’re in, and like, what do you do next. And I remember them just saying, you just put one foot in front of the other, and you show up and you figure it out. And I think that, I think that that’s something that I say to myself a lot when there’s like, a day where I’m like, I don’t know what to do, you know? Because I think that that’s what’s hard about being the founder and the CEO is like, you always have to know what to do. And I think that it’s, it helps me get through like that moment, you know, where you’re like, I’m not really sure what to do. And I think that the the first, the first step, is taking a step forward, you know, and just knowing that showing up and and trying to figure out what to do next is, is the job. It’s not about always having made the right decision. It’s not always being in the right place at the right time. Yeah, I think that just really gets me through when I feel like, oh my gosh, why did we do this? We had no idea that there would be tariffs or whatever is happening, right? And just, but just saying, like, you know, that’s the job is, is putting one foot in front of the other and making the next, the next call that you have to.

Kara Goldin 29:00
I love that. So last question, so your personal Copper Cow go to skew that you just cannot live without.

Debbie Mullin 29:12
That’s a good question. I just did like a ton of vanilla tasting right now before this call. So it’s hard for me to not be like the vanilla is just the best, especially, like, right now, like I’m obsessed with, if you make, if you take our pour overs and you just make, like, a shot of coffee, worth it, it basically becomes an it’s basically an espresso pour that first extraction is so is so strong, and then I just make an iced latte with it immediately. And that’s like, I’d say that that’s like, just the thing that the moment that I look forward to is I, like, drop my kids off at school, and I come home and I make, make one, and it’s just so amazing. So I’d say that that’s like, like, a vanilla pour over made into a latte. Is like, my go to right now.

Kara Goldin 29:55
I love it. Well, that sounds delicious. So I. Will definitely give that a try. But Debbie, thank you so much for joining us today and sharing all your wisdom and sharing all about Copper Cow Coffee, the story and Vietnamese coffee, and all the people that you’re helping and the consumers that are also being introduced to something that is just so so delicious. So you have done an excellent job. And thank you again for coming on and sharing for sure so and thank you everyone for listening as well, until next time on the Kara Goldin show. Thank you, Debbie, thanks so much for having me. Thanks again for listening to the Kara Goldin show. If you would please give us a review and feel free to share this podcast with others who would benefit and of course, feel free to subscribe so you don’t miss a single episode of our podcast. Just a reminder that I can be found on all platforms. At Kara Goldin, I would love to hear from you too. So feel free to DM me, and if you want to hear more about my journey, I hope you will have a listen or pick up a copy of my Wall Street Journal, best selling book, undaunted, where I share more about my journey, including founding and building hint, we are here every Monday, Wednesday and Friday. Thanks for listening and goodbye for now.

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Samantha Gold: Founder & CEO of Motette

732

Luna Aziz: Founder & CEO of Legendairy Milk